LC 250 Hate = It’s REAL

[RCFTE]

"Although I will have to honestly say if I was to reverse the timeframe to October and do it all over again , I probably would have opted for a Ford Raptor R just based on value for dollar because there is no comparison. Unfortunately Toyota/Lexus vehicles do not hold the same values or desirability as they did pre COVID and I really don’t think they ever will again."

I think you just bought the wrong vehicle.

Thank You. Actually I think you are right. I probably did buy the wrong vehicle and didn’t realize it. I actually love the vehicle and I think Toyota nailed it with the design, the overall build quality, the interior, and the suspension set up. But although the vehicle positives definitely outweigh the negatives, the 4 negatives the vehicle has that really bother me = MPG’S, Tank size, Engine choice ( engine runs fine but the engine is to small for a 5500 pound SUV and that’s why it is not efficient), and resale/value for the money spent ( unfortunately you can thank a lot of that due to consumer sentiment and social media) .

We all have different metrics we rank higher than others and I am really into numbers and stats, so value and potential resale value for daily drivers is very important to me and in the current climate we live in Toyota/Lexus trucks and full size SUV’S are not desirable like they where pre covid which in terms effects value and resale value which used to be a very strong point for purchasing a Toyota/lexus vehicle.

Unfortunately in today’s world we live in, the social media MOB has a huge influence in a lot of things we do today. They can really enhance a item and they can also set a match to it and in this particular case the LX, GX, LC 250, TACOMA, and the forerunner have been tarnished badly.

Remeber there is a saying in the stock market = the stock is not the price and the price is not always the stock.

 

[LC_DFW]

Thank You. Actually I think you are right. I probably did buy the wrong vehicle and didn’t realize it. I actually love the vehicle and I think Toyota nailed it with the design, the overall build quality, the interior, and the suspension set up. But although the vehicle positives definitely outweigh the negatives, the 4 negatives the vehicle has that really bother me = MPG’S, Tank size, Engine choice ( engine runs fine but the engine is to small for a 5500 pound SUV and that’s why it is not efficient), and resale/value for the money spent ( unfortunately you can thank a lot of that due to consumer sentiment and social media) .

We all have different metrics we rank higher than others and I am really into numbers and stats, so value and potential resale value for daily drivers is very important to me and in the current climate we live in Toyota/Lexus trucks and full size SUV’S are not desirable like they where pre covid which in terms effects value and resale value which used to be a very strong point for purchasing a Toyota/lexus vehicle.

Unfortunately in today’s world we live in, the social media MOB has a huge influence in a lot of things we do today. They can really enhance a item and they can also set a match to it and in this particular case the LX, GX, LC 250, TACOMA, and the forerunner have been tarnished badly.

Remeber there is a saying in the stock market = the stock is not the price and the price is not always the stock.

Why not just trade it in and move on.... Your mind is made up about this car, so no matter what others have to say, you will still have that regret on buying LC250. Buy what your heart desires and enjoy life.

 

[Joseph503]

Innovation marches on and change is hard for some people, especially older people.

"If I had asked people what they wanted, they would say faster horses" Henry Ford

"It's not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent that survives, but the one that is the most adaptable to change" Charles Darwin

 

[HammerTheWall]

So much noise around the LC250. Well, sales are showing Toyota got it right. So many people demanding a ‘real’ 4x4 with massive HP and huge tires and . Ford listened and gave the world the Bronco. The pundits rejoiced a new breed of 4x4 had arrived. A proper one. And yet, Ford dealer lots sit with massive inventories of unsold Broncos.

I really don't get the notion that you need a big NA V8 to have a "real" 4x4. Old school LCs, Jeeps, even Jimnies aren't suffering one bit by not having them. It's the Jeremy Clarkson mentality of "speed and power" - for super cars, sure, but for off-road daily drivers? Meh.

And you're right...drive by the local Ford dealer and it's the same Broncos sitting there month after month. I think CAT and Scout by way of VW are coming back, but I don't know how much effect they'll have on LC sales.

 

[ctgallosb]

The primary reason I’m on this forum is to connect with other owners, see pics and learn more about mods and adventures people are having. Brining in opinions of amateur YTers is fine but these guys don’t own the cars and just say whatever will pay them the most.

 

[Buckfever]

As far as the value equation, I definitely did not need to buy a First Edition, but they offered it to me at $4996 discount as long as I committed to an immediate purchase because they said they were going to trade with another dealer. As to whether that was true or not that discount created enough of a value equation for me to jump on it. Had everything I wanted round headlights, 18" wheels and Trail Dust. I'll keep it for 250K miles so good enough.

I do think the pricing on these vehicle in general though is too high. But when I consider the 1958s that can readily be picked up for $4K off, I'm hard pressed to find a better value out there at least right now.

The Off Road 4Runner with the IForce Max is priced right there, is that a better value?

I came from a Macan GTS which is one of the better SUVs in terms of performance and previously a V8 4Runner, which was my benchmark in terms of expectations.

Maybe I came into it with low expectations. I mean a 4 cylinder really? The low end torque and responsiveness is absolutely amazing. Pretty much everything in terms of performance has greatly exceeded my expectations. I thought it would be a durable beast. I did not expect it to be this much fun. Maybe you're not supposed to drive it the way I do.

But I wasn't looking for Porsche level handling or Ford Raptor exhilaration.

 

[JJP]

Thank goodness we don't buy things based on public opinion - If we did I'm not sure we would have anything (or worse, maybe we would have everything). We've had great experiences with Toyota for decades so I'm not worried about the naysayers, and if there are issues with the new build/platform, then we will deal with them (as I expect Toyota to) as they arise. Toyota provides quality, and longevity, and sure, they aren't cheap, but you get what you pay for, and so far what we paid for has exceeded our expectations.

If you know, you know - Peace!

 

[chrisw2069]

Haters always hate! Electronic trolls love to bash! Do I agree with gas tank problem? Yes! It needs a bigger tank! If the Lexus better? I personally do not think so… but that’s my opinion and I don’t go bashing GX’s or talk about the good ol’ days of past Land Cruisers… that’s like old guys talking about back in their day. If they don’t like it…. Don’t buy it. If you’re unhappy with it, sell it and buy an older LC or GX…. No vehicle with any maker is PERFECT…. It’s a machine. Hell for that matter people are far from perfect. Enjoy the LC250… I do!

 

[KSea]

At this point in life, the LC checks the boxes that are most important to me. There's always going to be something out there that does something better. But for me, there's just not much out there that does everything as well.

Agree! Traded my ‘22 4R for it and honestly loved that vehicle but it’s like comparing apples and oranges when people ask how they differ. This LC is awesome! More comfort, so much better on pavement— I don’t hesitate before passing cars lol, it’s got a ton of cabin space and it’s solid… excellent in the snow. It is new to me (no off road yet) but no looking back here! So fun to drive. One thing I do agree though… gas station visits far too frequent.

 

[ChrisMA1B]

They said the same bullshit about the 5th gen 4runner and that turned out to be one of the best cars ever made. Who gives a shit what they say.
The LC250 is better than the 5th gen 4Runner.

I agree - I traded a 5th gen 4R in for my 2024 1958 LC. The LC gets significantly better mileage and better "pickup" than the 4R. It has better styling and comfort as well. The 4R was tough, but so is the LC. Do I wish it had a bigger fuel tank? Yes. That is why the make 5 gal cans...

 

[DeepDive]

Let’s be clear about something. Negative reviews just get a lot more clicks on social media than positive reviews do. These just aren’t going to be for everyone. I bought it as sort of an interim vehicle. Have an EV SUV on order for 2027. I may just end up keeping this one instead. Every vehicle I’ve ever owned had had trade offs. Do agree that range and mpg could be better, but that topics been beaten to death here. We also have to acknowledge that a bigger fuel tank = more weight = lower mpg. It is what it is

 

[TAP34]

First off this is not a troll thread, because I personally own a LC 250 First Edition that I purchased in October.

Before buying my LC 250 First edition I did some/a lot of research via YouTube and written articles and I test drove 3 different LC 250’s, plus I test drove a GX 550, so in fairness I knew what I was getting myself into. I did a fairly in depth review on my LC 250 Likes and dislikes probably 1 month ago. And my stance has not changed. I pretty much really like/love the LC 250 but there are 2 things I really hate = fuel economy and 18 gallon tank. Everything else I really like. I know it’s better off road than the 200 series LC and I personally likes the looks better.

Here comes the unfortunate downfall of the LC 250 and unfortunately it really is not fair, but it’s the world we live in today and that undoing is YOUTUBE and SOCIAL MEDIA. Let’s be honest the social media automotive industry, and I call them social media automotive industry for a reason because they are not journalists like they think they are, has really hurt the LC 250, along with Toyota/lexus brand in general. If You where to take a full day and just do a lot of research via YouTube, written articles, and utilize other sources like article comments, the general consensus from reviewers and consumers is far more negative than positive. For Example lets look at the common summary they you will hear from most consumers and reviewers of the LC 250 =

1) not a real Landcruiser.

2) cheaply built compared to the LC 200 and other SUV’S.

3) The GX is far better and is the REAL Landcruiser.

4) terrible engine choice to put in a Landcruiser

5) This is a Prado = light duty cheap Landcruiser

6) The vehicle sounds “ Tinty” and cheaply made

7) Ground clearance is terrible and it is better on the LC 200, although after climbing underneath mine I found that my lowest ground clearance is 10 inches with no lift and BFG KO3’S 275 R 18’S. I guess I can not read a ruler or maybe I got lucky with the build on mine.

8) Fuel economy is terrible.

9) small fuel tank

10 ) Terrible acceleration

11) way to expensive for a cheaply made vehicle.

12) How could Toyota put a Rav 4 engine in a Landcruiser.

Do I agree with sentiments ? NO. The only points I agree with are the fuel economy and the small fuel tank. But unfortunately social media , especially YouTube, has really done damage to the LC 250 in terms of initial reputation and perception. It’s even to a point where LC 200 owners literally piss on LC 250 owners and GX 550 owners do the same. It’s really a shame because it is actually just dividing the brand even more and slowly eroding the existing values and potential resale values in the toilet. But unfortunately this social media hate isn’t just on the LC 250 , it’s on a lot of Toyota/lexus products today = LX 600, GX 550, TUNDRA, TACOMA, and the new 4 Runner . They are all getting trashed badly and although you would not think it could effect future values of vehicles, it most certainly can and it does today, and resale value has always been a strong point of Toyota/lexus. I will illustrate how perception and YouTube effected 1 particular Toyota model, in this case for the better. The LC 200. Prior to Covid you could walk into a Toyota dealership and if they had a new LC 200 on the with a MSRP of $ 86,000.00 you could walk out of the dealership purchasing that vehicle for around $ 77,000.00. Once covid hit and Toyota announced the end of the V-8 Landcruiser and rumors started to surface about a possible Hybrid Landcruiser a 2020/2021 Landcruiser with 40,000 miles was selling for $ 85,000.00 and guess what, people are actually bragging about paying that price for a “ REAL LANDCRUISER” . By the time these people purchase a warranty and put cool looking off road tires on their “ real Landcruiser “ they have $ 100,000.00 in a used 40,000 mile LC 200, but the LC 250 at $ 58,000 to $ 76,000 ( first edition ) is to expensive. Hence the power of social media.

If social media can effect a presidential election like it did in 2020, it can most certainly effect vehicle values. I’m kind of a nerd with stats, but what really boggles my mind is a company like Ford rolls out Recalls literally every other day and in a lot of cases there is better value in buying a Ford vehicle than a Toyota/lexus and just think 5-10 years ago you never would have seen this. And you very rarely see a negative review on a Ford vehicle, especially the Ford performance variants like Raptors and mustangs. Amazing.

I know that’s a long thread but after looking at some values and actual numbers in correspondence with timelines with the recent Toyota/Lexus hate, you know the old saying, NUMBERS DON’T LIE.

I actually think Toyota/lexus still builds a quality vehicle and in most cases builds a much better vehicle than the big 3, but resale and value and social media reviews are telling a different story. Personally I think Toyota should have named the LC 250 the new FJ cruiser, I think that would quieted a lot of the mass hysteria because unfortunately a lot of United States consumers do not have a clue how important the LC 250 prado is to the Landcruiser lineage and history.

Although I will have to honestly say if I was to reverse the timeframe to October and do it all over again , I probably would have opted for a Ford Raptor R just based on value for dollar because there is no comparison. Unfortunately Toyota/Lexus vehicles do not hold the same values or desirability as they did pre COVID and I really don’t think they ever will again.

Yes, YouTube and social media has become extremely powerful.

Easy easy … it’s just old fashion jealousy.

 

[uraniumrich]

Welcome to No Complain Janauary

 

[LC1E-2024]

I used to read religiously and follow the recommendations of Motor Trend, Car & Driver, Automobile Magazine. They'd drive the vehicles. Do comparisons. They at least attempted to be non-biased. Nowadays there's social media taking place of those magazines and everybody has an opinion even if they've never even seen one in person let alone drive or own one. After owning many vehicles, I can say that there is no perfect vehicle no matter what anybody says. There's always give and take. Always.

I've owned many different SUVs and trucks: Chevy Silverado, Chevy Tahoe, Jeep Wrangler, Jeep Gladiator, Jeep Grand Cherokee, Mercedes GLE 450, and of course, my LC FE. My wife is on her second Audi Q5, which she loves, and I drive that somewhat frequently. There have been a few others as well over the years.

With the exception of the Jeep Gladiator Majave Edition, I've enjoyed all of them even though they're all very different. I loved my Wrangler and Grand Cherokee. My wife's Q5 drives SO well. The Mercedes was an amazing vehicle, but I didn't dare drive it on the beach or put a fishing rod in it so, while it drove great and had great power (straight 6 with mild hybrid drive), it wasn't for me.

My LC FE is a well-built vehicle, perfect size for my tastes, and with really good power. I'm not afraid to drive it on the beach or to take it camping. I find the gas mileage adequate for a vehicle of this type although my one gripe is the small size of the fuel tank. I've seen people ask the question if the GX tank (+3 gallons) will fit in the LC, but I've never heard the answer. If it does, I may look into that in the future. I guess I do have a second gripe and that would be the infotainment center. It isn't super well thought out, but I've gotten used to it. I hope they have a future update that makes it a little more seamless. So, other than those two gripes, I think it's exactly what it's supposed to be which in my mind is an upscale utility vehicle that does what it's supposed to do, has a great 4-wheel drive system, drives well, performs well, and I expect will be relatively trouble free because it is a Toyota.

I should add that pretty much everywhere I go I get thumbs up and I get asked about it from random people from all walks of life. It definitely draws attention, in a good way, wherever I go.

 

[Joseph503]

Thank You. Actually I think you are right. I probably did buy the wrong vehicle and didn’t realize it. I actually love the vehicle and I think Toyota nailed it with the design, the overall build quality, the interior, and the suspension set up. But although the vehicle positives definitely outweigh the negatives, the 4 negatives the vehicle has that really bother me = MPG’S, Tank size, Engine choice ( engine runs fine but the engine is to small for a 5500 pound SUV and that’s why it is not efficient), and resale/value for the money spent ( unfortunately you can thank a lot of that due to consumer sentiment and social media) .

We all have different metrics we rank higher than others and I am really into numbers and stats, so value and potential resale value for daily drivers is very important to me and in the current climate we live in Toyota/Lexus trucks and full size SUV’S are not desirable like they where pre covid which in terms effects value and resale value which used to be a very strong point for purchasing a Toyota/lexus vehicle.

Unfortunately in today’s world we live in, the social media MOB has a huge influence in a lot of things we do today. They can really enhance a item and they can also set a match to it and in this particular case the LX, GX, LC 250, TACOMA, and the forerunner have been tarnished badly.

Remeber there is a saying in the stock market = the stock is not the price and the price is not always the stock.

I can honestly say that the social media MOB has no influence on what I do or how I live my life. I never buy a vehicle for an "investment" and I find it curious on how you have already concluded that the resale value has been eroded by a bunch of anonymous haters.

 

[mdallas]

My other current car is a BMW X5 M50i, and I have mainly driven Mercedes, BMW with dash of Land Rover thrown in over the last 35 years.

Love my LC 250 as much as any of them!

 

[shedkept]

Face it; It is a Prado in the rest of the world. What we got and what everyone else got.
Although the diesel has been neutered to 6 cylinders in the 300.

 

[Alex_Prado]

I love our Prado 250. In the UAE we don’t get the hybrid model (just petrol) so I haven’t experienced any of the electrical issues that I’ve seen reported and I’m not worried about that side of things. I’ve been out a fair bit in the dunes (including some pretty soft stuff) and never been stuck - it handles everything so well.

Being an Aussie I do keep an eye on Ronny’s adventures and the others such as KAON (who make awesome products and just got a 250 to tinker with) but as for the likes of carsales etc. I really couldn’t give a flying F what they think! I think the Australian public disagrees too as the back orders huge on them down under and people have to wait months!

I used to have a Nissan Patrol Super Safari, and while I miss its “rawness” the 250 is much better on and off road, feels more lively in the sand, and gets me out in the dunes faster and more comfortably - and enjoying more time at camp relaxing with family and friends.

Finally - gotta agree with the post above. It’s not a “real” Landcruiser, it’s a Prado but there is nothing wrong with that!

 

[DeepDive]

I used to read religiously and follow the recommendations of Motor Trend, Car & Driver, Automobile Magazine. They'd drive the vehicles. Do comparisons. They at least attempted to be non-biased. Nowadays there's social media taking place of those magazines and everybody has an opinion even if they've never even seen one in person let alone drive or own one. After owning many vehicles, I can say that there is no perfect vehicle no matter what anybody says. There's always give and take. Always.

I've owned many different SUVs and trucks: Chevy Silverado, Chevy Tahoe, Jeep Wrangler, Jeep Gladiator, Jeep Grand Cherokee, Mercedes GLE 450, and of course, my LC FE. My wife is on her second Audi Q5, which she loves, and I drive that somewhat frequently. There have been a few others as well over the years.

With the exception of the Jeep Gladiator Majave Edition, I've enjoyed all of them even though they're all very different. I loved my Wrangler and Grand Cherokee. My wife's Q5 drives SO well. The Mercedes was an amazing vehicle, but I didn't dare drive it on the beach or put a fishing rod in it so, while it drove great and had great power (straight 6 with mild hybrid drive), it wasn't for me.

My LC FE is a well-built vehicle, perfect size for my tastes, and with really good power. I'm not afraid to drive it on the beach or to take it camping. I find the gas mileage adequate for a vehicle of this type although my one gripe is the small size of the fuel tank. I've seen people ask the question if the GX tank (+3 gallons) will fit in the LC, but I've never heard the answer. If it does, I may look into that in the future. I guess I do have a second gripe and that would be the infotainment center. It isn't super well thought out, but I've gotten used to it. I hope they have a future update that makes it a little more seamless. So, other than those two gripes, I think it's exactly what it's supposed to be which in my mind is an upscale utility vehicle that does what it's supposed to do, has a great 4-wheel drive system, drives well, performs well, and I expect will be relatively trouble free because it is a Toyota.

I should add that pretty much everywhere I go I get thumbs up and I get asked about it from random people from all walks of life. It definitely draws attention, in a good way, wherever I go.

This concept that the engine is too small is based purely on what 4 cylinder engines used to be. Plenty of power and torque on this vehicle with the hybrid setup. Agree with your assessment.

 

[jbe2289]

In the 1980s Toyota introduced the 4Runner to the North American market because they realized most buyers didn’t want to pay a premium for the Land Cruiser brand 4x4. Toyota plans to sell at least 3x the number of 4Runners in the US vs. LC250 this year, A lot of the positive LC250 content comes from markets that don’t have 4Runners with less features and lower prices imo. It will be interesting to see how the LX700h is received as the top dog LC in the US.

It will be even more interesting to see how the 4Runner does vs the LC250. I might be wrong, but I think a lot of people will go LC once the 4Runners are out. They are too close in price and at least for me, my strong preference is the LC all the way around on appearance inside and out. And the pricing for what you get in my opinion weighs towards the 1958 versus a hybrid Off-Road, and the LC can likely be had for cheaper or similar price depending on premium package or not. I don’t get what Toyota did here with the LC250 and the 4Runner and price overlap. In all regards the LC seems to be a more appealing vehicle and the new 4Runner seems designed for a teenage boy, but maybe it is just me. When looking at pricing for the 4Runner is makes the LC250 seem underpriced. And seeing how well it is built compared to what else is out there, I actually think the LC250 is priced right.