Break-in period

[bluebullet]

I seriously dispute this. Can this be substantiated? Personally, would never drive for 5 hours at Interstate speeds immediately following delivery, but to each their own...

perhaps stick to the blue highways. Read William Least Heat Moon's book, a good read: Blue Highways William Least Heat Moon for sale | eBay

 

[AustinLC250]

It takes me a whole year to drive 5k miles. I'm definitely doing oil changes at least every 5k miles. On my 92 FJ80 I'm doing oil changes every 2k-3k miles.

I also plan to do my first oil change at 1k.

 

[qberg]

Y'all are getting way too far into the weeds with this. There really isn't much conditioning to do to modern engines and super frequent oil changes are largely placebo.

If you would build a fault tree for why a vehicle is taken off the road, NG break-in procedure and NG manufacturer spec for oil change intervals as root cause are pretty low odds. An accident, abuse/neglect, natural disaster, or some chronic design problem (that is expensive to fix) are far more likely to be why your Land Cruiser doesn't meet your length of life expectations. With this being a new vehicle and new engine, we don't have any data to go by. It's all feels. Maybe in 5 years time when there are 100k examples on the road and blackstone lab reports, there might be some understanding or recommendations. The people with the most data are the engineers at Toyota and they've made a recommendation based on normal and severe usage. That's the literally the only recommendation coming from a place of knowledge at this point.

 

[wedemmoez]

It takes me a whole year to drive 5k miles. I'm definitely doing oil changes at least every 5k miles. On my 92 FJ80 I'm doing oil changes every 2k-3k miles.

I also plan to do my first oil change at 1k.

my wife is the same. We got her a new Mercedes GLC last year and she's put a touch over 6000 miles on it in one year.

Meanwhile, I've had my LC for a month and its about to hit 2000 miles.

 

[ultane]

I am curious about the long term report on cars following Toyota’s 10000 miles oil change schedule. I am sure Toyota knows what they are talking about, but also I was surprised that they don’t have any maintenance schedule on the manual after 120K miles. Is that how they define the “life” of this vehicle?

Good question.. Inquiring minds want to know..

 

[Marinna]

Majority of Toyota’s on the road probably follow the manufacturer’s recommended oil change schedule. Average owner doesn’t put much thought into car maintenance and follow what the shop recommends. Since average Toyota is reliable, it is probably OK for most cases.

Conventional engine oils degrade rapidly with heat and need to be changed since they lose their lubricant and other protective properties. Synthetic oils are much more resistant to heat degradation and therefore maintain their properties for much longer time. So you need to think about why you are changing oil. If the intention is to remove contaminants (gas, water, debris, metals), it makes sense to change oil. There are conditions that may increase these and warrant early oil changes. But if these are minimal, the oil will be ok for the manufacture’s recommendation.

I think the maintenance schedule ends at 120k because it becomes some what meaningless after that to give generalized recommendations. After that point, maintenance should be based more on the vehicles needs.

I would say the first ever oil change is more about debris... the follow up changes will be more about recovering viscosity. The theory, at least from these YouTube guys (I never had a turbo engine before), are turbo engine is generating significantly more heat than naturally aspirated engine, hence they have accelerated degradation. I am sure Toyota engineer knows what they are doing, so I am uncertain about this huge gap between mechanics' recommendation and manufacturer' recommendation.

I heard this one claim, from Nissan senior executive, in one of their notorious class action that they claim the "life cycle" for the car is limited to what they recommend their car owner to perform maintenance schedule. In other word, once it gets outside the maintenance schedule, the auto company will consider the car is out of its life cycle. That is why every time we see these "lifetime warranty", they do not really mean lifetime in our definition. I am not sure whether Toyota is taking the same position. But I am sure they wouldn't say something like "LC can be expected to last at least to 300K miles"

 

[ultane]

I would say the first ever oil change is more about debris... the follow up changes will be more about recovering viscosity. The theory, at least from these YouTube guys (I never had a turbo engine before), are turbo engine is generating significantly more heat than naturally aspirated engine, hence they have accelerated degradation. I am sure Toyota engineer knows what they are doing, so I am uncertain about this huge gap between mechanics' recommendation and manufacturer' recommendation.

I heard this one claim, from Nissan senior executive, in one of their notorious class action that they claim the "life cycle" for the car is limited to what they recommend their car owner to perform maintenance schedule. In other word, once it gets outside the maintenance schedule, the auto company will consider the car is out of its life cycle. That is why every time we see these "lifetime warranty", they do not really mean lifetime in our definition. I am not sure whether Toyota is taking the same position. But I am sure they wouldn't say something like "LC can be expected to last at least to 300K miles"

Oil is cheap. Engines are expensive.

 

[EOD Guy]

No one will ever hurt an engine by changing the oil...... prove me wrong.

 

[Marinna]

No one will ever hurt an engine by changing the oil...... prove me wrong.

But no one will want to spend unnecessarily money neither, I think that is the point, especially changing oil these days could get expensive. In my area easy it get close to $100. If they are not helping I could just use these money to buy myself something more useful.

 

[ultane]

But no one will want to spend unnecessarily money neither, I think that is the point, especially changing oil these days could get expensive. In my area easy it get close to $100. If they are not helping I could just use these money to buy myself something more useful.

Buy a Fumoto oil drain valve, with the clear plastic tubing, and a pair of car ramps at Horrible Frieght or Tractor Supply. If you are old like me, buy a ‘creeper’ from Horrible Freight as well.

 

[EOD Guy]

But no one will want to spend unnecessarily money neither, I think that is the point, especially changing oil these days could get expensive. In my area easy it get close to $100. If they are not helping I could just use these money to buy myself something more useful.

Yup, you spend your money as you see fit.

 

[DenisLM]

I just did my oil change and was quite dark.
1400 miles in.
No funny smells or shinny stuff.
I would absolutely change it at least every 5k based what I just see.

$39 oil (full synth on Costco)
$9 filter (that i could get for $5 if I bought the 10 case)
Not a terrible deal.

 

[EOD Guy]

I just did my oil change and was quite dark.
1400 miles in.
No funny smells or shinny stuff.
I would absolutely change it at least every 5k based what I just see.

$39 oil (full synth on Costco)
$9 filter (that i could get for $5 if I bought the 10 case)
Not a terrible deal.

My local Toyota dealer has them over the counter for $53 for 10, so $50 is great!

 

[qberg]

Oil is cheap. Engines are expensive.

Being someone that is willing to spend $50-100 extra per year on oil changes all in the name of long term durability, why do you choose an unknown quantity over a mature model that is well known -- with data -- to be very reliable?

The Land Cruiser has a new engine, a new platform, a new transmission, new electronics, and tons more features/tech that can fail. A 200 series land cruiser, a 5th gen 4runner, or a GX460 are well known to be reliable and do the same job as the 250 series Land Cruiser. It can't be fuel savings because the 4Runner still is cheaper to operate due to the premium requirement in the Land Cruiser. The safe bet for a long lasting vehicle is going to be the 4Runner every day of the week. We have 15 years of durability data for it. The Land Cruiser could be perfect out of the gate, but chances are it will have some teething issues or some problem area that pops up as these get age.

It feels like you really trust Toyota to design and manufacturer a brand new model... but don't trust them to spec an oil change interval.

 

[jmqb1]

Being someone that is willing to spend $50-100 extra per year on oil changes all in the name of long term durability, why do you choose an unknown quantity over a mature model that is well known -- with data -- to be very reliable?

The Land Cruiser has a new engine, a new platform, a new transmission, new electronics, and tons more features/tech that can fail. A 200 series land cruiser, a 5th gen 4runner, or a GX460 are well known to be reliable and do the same job as the 250 series Land Cruiser. It can't be fuel savings because the 4Runner still is cheaper to operate due to the premium requirement in the Land Cruiser. The safe bet for a long lasting vehicle is going to be the 4Runner every day of the week. We have 15 years of durability data for it. The Land Cruiser could be perfect out of the gate, but chances are it will have some teething issues or some problem area that pops up as these get age.

It feels like you really trust Toyota to design and manufacturer a brand new model... but don't trust them to spec an oil change interval.

Regardless of a vehicle's reliability history, consistent maintenance is key to longevity. I’m willing to spend more on things like frequent oil changes because I believe that's how you achieve reliability from any vehicle, new or old.

 

[ultane]

Being someone that is willing to spend $50-100 extra per year on oil changes all in the name of long term durability, why do you choose an unknown quantity over a mature model that is well known -- with data -- to be very reliable?

The Land Cruiser has a new engine, a new platform, a new transmission, new electronics, and tons more features/tech that can fail. A 200 series land cruiser, a 5th gen 4runner, or a GX460 are well known to be reliable and do the same job as the 250 series Land Cruiser. It can't be fuel savings because the 4Runner still is cheaper to operate due to the premium requirement in the Land Cruiser. The safe bet for a long lasting vehicle is going to be the 4Runner every day of the week. We have 15 years of durability data for it. The Land Cruiser could be perfect out of the gate, but chances are it will have some teething issues or some problem area that pops up as these get age.

It feels like you really trust Toyota to design and manufacturer a brand new model... but don't trust them to spec an oil change interval.

1. I am not even sure what your point is.

2. Almost all of us will be using the LC in the category that requires oil change interval to be 5,000 miles, per Toyota’s own recommendations.

3. After using Mobil 1 for 9 years in my 2015 Ford Transit 350 heavy duty cargo van (3.5L twin turbo), I can easily tell you that there is almost no value in the oil (based on 9 years of Blackstone Labs data) when stretching the OCI to 10,000 miles.

4. But if you like life on the edge, go for it. I am not going down that path again.

Oil is cheep. Engines are expensive.

 

[qberg]

1. I am not even sure what your point is.

2. Almost all of us will be using the LC in the category that requires oil change interval to be 5,000 miles, per Toyota’s own recommendations.

3. After using Mobil 1 for 9 years in my 2015 Ford Transit 350 heavy duty cargo van (3.5L twin turbo), I can easy tell you that there is almost no value in the oil (based on 9 years of Blackstone Labs data) when stretching the OCI to 10,000 miles.

4. But if you like life on the edge, go for it. I am not going down that path again.

Oil is cheep. Engines are expensive.

1) My point is if you trust Toyota enough to buy a new, unproven model, you should trust them to spec the OCIs.

2) 10k OCIs for non-severe, 5k OCIs for severe. Each owner should consider their driving cycle regarding what the manufacturer calls out for non-severe and severe. If someone just commutes in their Land Cruiser, they are wasting money by following the severe cycle. Dusty roads, roof top carriers, towing, etc should follow the 5k OCI because that's what the manual says.

3) Apples and oranges. Different manufacturer, different use case, different category of vehicle (full ton van versus light duty SUV). 10k on oil in engine A with a 5L sump is going to be different than 10k on oil in engine A with a 6L sump just like engine B with a 5L sump might be ok on 10k because of other design considerations. Block, head, and turbo temp management also impacts how the oil wears. The hybrid motor doing some of the work is also going to reduce the wear on the engine and oil. Presumably Toyota considered that when they designed the engine and spec'd the OCI based on that. We can't just say 10k is bad for normal use without considering the whole system. People are free to change the oil every 100 miles if they want; it is their money. They shouldn't be out there claiming that it will ensure reliability to 300k miles, though, because they don't know. None of us know.

Oil is cheep. Engines are expensive. Read the manual, follow the recommendations.

 

[EOD Guy]

Everyone has the right to their own opinion, just don't get too upset when everyone doesn't agree with it.

 

[Trailman]

In case people missed it, here is a video worth watching that will help understand the importance of engine maintenance and frequency of oil changes. I’m planning on 5,000 mile intervals for a couple of reasons:

1.) Longer turbo life
2.) I enjoy maintaining vehicles and plan to own this one a long time.
3.) It’s inexpensive and the lifeblood of our engines
4.) Manufacturers are incentivized to use less oil over the expected life of the vehicle to improve their CAFE standards. 10,000 mile oil change intervals are to help the manufacturers, not the owners.

 

[ultane]

In case people missed it, here is a video worth watching that will help understand the importance of engine maintenance and frequency of oil changes. I’m planning on 5,000 mile intervals for a couple of reasons:

1.) Longer turbo life
2.) I enjoy maintaining vehicles and plan to own this one a long time.
3.) It’s inexpensive and the lifeblood of our engines
4.) Manufacturers are incentivized to use less oil over the expected life of the vehicle to improve their CAFE standards. 10,000 mile oil change intervals are to help the manufacturers, not the owners.

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