Never have had either of these paint protection systems... but then have never paid 80K for a vehicle!
Looking for your experiences with these, but hearsay welcome.
Thx
Looking for your experiences with these, but hearsay welcome.
Thx
Ceramic Coating a rip-off? How about PPF?
- Thread starter ChillLC
- Start date
- Moderator
- #2
Re the PPF, depending on the vehicle color, it sure prevents the ugly chips on the front of the vehicle. Especially with white, the dark chip spots appear. Have zero experience with a ceramic coating, other than they seem terribly expensive. Definitely getting the frontal PPF with our LC, even though it will be Meteor Shower (hopefully, another story). Would be curious if port applied PPF is considered better/worse than dealer/vendor applied. At least the port PPF would be covered by the factory warranty, even if one relocates.
Living in an area with snow and heavily sanded roads, I won't ever have a vehicle without ppf.. ceramic isn't thick enough to compete if you really need it.
- Aug 2, 2023
- 149
- 107
- Vehicles
- 1999 4Runner SR5 5 speed manual, 2020 4Runner ORP w/KDSS, 2017 Chevy 2500HD Duramax
I put the 3M film on my High Country Silverado for $650. My daughter's front bumper on her Suburban rusted out with the painted white bumper. Winter is hard on paint jobs in Montana. Too much crap on the roads. You're gonna get chips no matter how hard you try to avoid it. The sensor on my 4Runner gets covered with snow/slush/glacial silt making the adaptive cruise go south on a 60 mile trip on nasty winter days. Plan to get the PPF at the port on mine.
Ceramic makes it easier to clean, stuff doesn't stick to the vehicle as easily. But it's not going to protect your vehicle from rocks, branches, etc. Ceramic doesn't offer much value to me, so I don't spend the money. But I'll be using PPF on the hood and front quarter panels since gravel is used liberally around here on winter roads.
I will be getting PPF and ceramic - and had the same on my last car. The PPF seems pretty effective at avoiding rock chips. I had a good experience for the last couple years with it.
The ceramic helps the car bead water and clean easier - such that a touchless car wash can do a pretty effective job keeping it clean.
If I was prioritizing, I would definitely get the PPF over the ceramic.
The port installed PPF looks like a decent job, not perfect, but IMO very cost effective. A private installer should do a little cleaner install job which will involve wrapping the edges of each each panel so that it appears seamless. But in my experience, it will cost more.
PPF on the front bumper, hood, fenders, A pillar, ceramic coat / full detail job, and tint on the front windows and rear hatch cost me a little under $3k on my last car.
If you are going to keep the LC long term, perhaps a worthy investment, and if you aren’t, I would just say that I doubt you get much of a return on investment. Either one is more about being OCD/protective than anything…
The ceramic helps the car bead water and clean easier - such that a touchless car wash can do a pretty effective job keeping it clean.
If I was prioritizing, I would definitely get the PPF over the ceramic.
The port installed PPF looks like a decent job, not perfect, but IMO very cost effective. A private installer should do a little cleaner install job which will involve wrapping the edges of each each panel so that it appears seamless. But in my experience, it will cost more.
PPF on the front bumper, hood, fenders, A pillar, ceramic coat / full detail job, and tint on the front windows and rear hatch cost me a little under $3k on my last car.
If you are going to keep the LC long term, perhaps a worthy investment, and if you aren’t, I would just say that I doubt you get much of a return on investment. Either one is more about being OCD/protective than anything…
I don't consider them rip offs and will never purchase a new car without installing them both. PPF protects against sand and stones. Maybe even the occasional brush with a post, or wall, or something like that. My oldest vehicle is a 2015 with 115,000 miles that my college daughter inherited, and we live in states notorious for front end chips thanks to snow removal. Not a single chip can be found on that vehicle where the PPF is installed. Same with our 2019 with 50,000 miles. It's worth it to me.
Ceramic doesn't protect against deep scratches or chips, but it does a fabulous job with acids (think bird droppings), and takes the typical abuse from light hand washing and drying a vehicle. And it makes washing so much easier. I apply my own ceramic (graphene, actually), so it only costs me about $80 in product, and I polish and reapply the graphene every 3 to 4 years. I typically don't polish much deeper than removing the previous layer of graphene when prepping the surface for reapplication, which keeps the paint as thick as possible for future correction if needed.
If you're going to automatic car washes with brushes, though, it won't take long before the ceramic is worn away. Those brushes are brutal on paint. Honestly, if you're using an automated car wash with brushes, paint appearance probably isn't your highest priority, and the ceramic isn't worth it.
Ceramic doesn't protect against deep scratches or chips, but it does a fabulous job with acids (think bird droppings), and takes the typical abuse from light hand washing and drying a vehicle. And it makes washing so much easier. I apply my own ceramic (graphene, actually), so it only costs me about $80 in product, and I polish and reapply the graphene every 3 to 4 years. I typically don't polish much deeper than removing the previous layer of graphene when prepping the surface for reapplication, which keeps the paint as thick as possible for future correction if needed.
If you're going to automatic car washes with brushes, though, it won't take long before the ceramic is worn away. Those brushes are brutal on paint. Honestly, if you're using an automated car wash with brushes, paint appearance probably isn't your highest priority, and the ceramic isn't worth it.
- Moderator
- #10
Our car wash, at the dealer, and allegedly Toyota approved, as posted on it, is not brushes, but foam strips. They also use it to wash the new and used vehicles on the lot. So far, so good, but as mentioned above, would never follow a mud-encrusted redneck truck through. Luckily, the 2024 LC does not have the glossy plastic to garner scratches.
I got my LC250 wrapped with Xpel Stealth PPF. It has a 10yr warranty and paid $4800 for full body. I wanted to make sure i was protected especially out on the trails.
Good to hear the foam strips are more gentle. I hope you'll keep us updated on how your finish ages over time with that method.
Love Rexburg, BTW. My wife and I recently stopped by for a picnic on the temple grounds during our drive home to Utah from Island Park. Great town.
Thanks for posting this. I was wondering how much a full body wrap would cost. PPF would save the paint from desert pin striping, a common occurrence on many trails, and while it's pricey it's also a lot less expensive than a new factory-level finish. Xpel Stealth is top of the line, too.
A buddy of mine carries landscaping tools with him and actually trims the occasional bush sticking out into the trail. He's hardcore about preserving his Bronco's finish.
Hey there, would you mind sharing the name of your vendor in a message? I really regret not getting it done sooner.
OP
OP
- Thread starter
- #15
Thanks everyone for you thoughts... much appreciated. Much more support for PPF than I expected. I will definitely be checking with local installers in the next few days... before that first rock chip!
(and I also carry pruning shears in my vehicle!)
(and I also carry pruning shears in my vehicle!)
I have and had both ppf and ceramic coatings on multiple vehicles
Ppf
Pros
Very good at protecting from scratches and chips
Negatives
Expensive to place
Doesn’t have same shine as ceramic
At some point it will have to be replaced , if you wait to long depending on how stored and park it will not peel off but rather will have to be scraped off requiring repainting ,
It gets hard and brittle in 5-7 years depending
Ceramic coating have evolved
Pros
Less expensive
Beautiful shine
Easier clean up
Self healing ceramics have ability to repair light scratches or swirls
Negatives
Not as protective against rock chips and heavy scratches
Can’t run through brush car washes ,not sure they are good for any ppf or ceramics
Replace every 4-5 years depending on storage and parking
This my opinions I currently had a 5 year self healing ceramic put on my black FE
I decided against ppf because I hate having to remove it . It takes a professional to remove which is expensive and if you wait until it starts turning yellow or cracking it will be a royal pain and most people will tell you it will have to be painted because of scratches from removing.
I will never use ppf again because of that , unless you are tracking a car or extreme off-roading and willing to replace it often .
JMHO
Ppf
Pros
Very good at protecting from scratches and chips
Negatives
Expensive to place
Doesn’t have same shine as ceramic
At some point it will have to be replaced , if you wait to long depending on how stored and park it will not peel off but rather will have to be scraped off requiring repainting ,
It gets hard and brittle in 5-7 years depending
Ceramic coating have evolved
Pros
Less expensive
Beautiful shine
Easier clean up
Self healing ceramics have ability to repair light scratches or swirls
Negatives
Not as protective against rock chips and heavy scratches
Can’t run through brush car washes ,not sure they are good for any ppf or ceramics
Replace every 4-5 years depending on storage and parking
This my opinions I currently had a 5 year self healing ceramic put on my black FE
I decided against ppf because I hate having to remove it . It takes a professional to remove which is expensive and if you wait until it starts turning yellow or cracking it will be a royal pain and most people will tell you it will have to be painted because of scratches from removing.
I will never use ppf again because of that , unless you are tracking a car or extreme off-roading and willing to replace it often .
JMHO
Pay close attention to the actual areas of ppf/clear coat on your LC when received, my FE came with minimal protections for maximum price, lol. After oak trees seriously stained my white roof I decided to opt for a $1900 ceramic coat manuf & 5yr warr by Owners Pride. First time use for me, so far stains have been washing off in the rain. 2-3 time yearly $225 maint apps rec'd but not mandatory.
This. Had it on my Bronco and I will do it on this as well.
OP
OP
- Thread starter
- #19
Thanks for sharing your experience. My rig will be in garage when not out on the road, so very low percentage of time out in sun and weather. I assume this would extend the life of the ppf and address the removal issues... thoughts?
My main concern is rock chips on hood and front panels. Dislike look of the plastic deflectors.
PPF has changed over the years. The material now has self-healing capabilities for swirls and minor scratches, and I haven't seen the modern materials crack or yellow. This fall I'll hit 10 years on our Outback with 3M self-healing PPF installed, and while it doesn't look new, there's no cracking or yellowing. Typically the edges will collect some dirt over the years and that's where it shows age.
For removal, if it's ever needed, the key is heat. Do it on a hot, sunny day and sweep a heat gun over the edge before pulling up. It'll come off.
Land Cruiser Forum Photos
Land Cruiser Forum Photos
